There are a number of of music synthesizers available as software now, such as those in Reason and GarageBand. I'm interested in buying a MIDI keyboard to play with them.
There are three broad categories of products that would serve this duty. The first are simple MIDI control keyboards, which are made to control MIDI sound sources and don't produce any sound of their own. The second is MIDI synthesizers that have one or more built-in sounds and MIDI In/Out jacks for talking to other MIDI equipment; these are subdivided into expensive synths for serious musicians and cheap, feature-packed, cheesy home synths. The third category is the digital piano, which is designed to approximate as nearly as possible the experience and sound of playing an acoustic piano. Some of these have MIDI outputs, so they could be used to control other synths and soft-synths.
These three categories are different enough that I shouldn't attempt to combine them all in this one document. I should compare like with like, and have a good enough idea of what I want to know that in advance.
| Make | Model | Description | Piano Keys |
Pitch Wheel? |
Mod Wheel? |
MIDI knobs |
MIDI sliders |
MIDI buttons |
GB HCL? |
MIDI Class? |
MIDI I/O |
List | Cost | Width | Depth | Height | Weight | Power | Software | Comments |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| M-Audio | Keystation 49e | 49-key USB MIDI keyboard | 49 | 0 | 1 | 3 | $100 | $100 | 31.5" | 8.4" | 3.2" | ? | A/U | MA Tools | Cheap, full size, shift/keys emulate MIDI controls. | |||||
| M-Audio | Oxygen8 | 25-key USB MIDI keyboard | 25 | 8 | 1 | 3 | $180 | $140 | 16.5" | 9.6" | 3.3" | 3.6 | A/U/B | MA Tools | Tiny and portable, but I want at least 49 keys. | |||||
| M-Audio | Radium49 | 49-key USB MIDI keyboard | 49 | 8 | 8 | 3 | $200 | $160 | 29.5" | 9.3" | 3.4" | 7 | A/U/B | MA Tools | More MIDI controls. | |||||
| M-Audio | Ozone | Oxygen8 with built-in 24/96 audio interface | 25 | 8 | 1 | 3 | $250 | $250 | 16.5" | 9.6" | 3.6" | 4 | A/U | MA Tools | Tiny, slick, portable, but I want more keys. | |||||
| M-Audio | Radium61 | 61-key USB MIDI keyboard | 61 | 8 | 8 | 3 | $260 | $200 | 36.0" | 8.4" | 3.4" | 7 | A/U | MA Tools | More MIDI controls. | |||||
| Evolution | eKeys | compact 37-key USB MIDI keyboard | 37 | 0 | 0 | 0 | $60 | $48 | 18" | 4.5" | 1.6" | ? | A/U | SSII MT | Smaller sized consumer keyboard, no extra MIDI controls. | |||||
| Evolution | eKeys49 | Keystation 49e with bundle | 49 | 0 | 1 | 3 | 31.5" | 8.4" | 3.2" | ? | A/U | SSII MT | Cheap, full size, shift/keys emulate MIDI controls. | |||||||
| Evolution | MK 425C | 25-key USB MIDI keyboard | 25 | 8 | 0 | 10 | 0/1 | $190 | $150 | 19" | 8.4" | 4" | ? | A/U | SSII SL | More MIDI controls. | ||||
| Evolution | MK 449C | 49-key USB MIDI keyboard | 49 | 8 | 9 | 10 | 0/1 | $260 | $200 | 32" | 8.4" | 4" | ? | A/U | SSII SL | More MIDI controls. | ||||
| Evolution | MK 461C | 61-key USB MIDI keyboard | 61 | 12 | 9 | 10 | 0/1 | $330 | $260 | 39" | 8.4" | 4" | ? | A/U | SSII SL | More MIDI controls. | ||||
| Edirol | PCR-30 | 32-key USB MIDI keyboard | 32 | 8 | 8 | 9 | ? | 1/1 | $225 | $170 | 23.6" | 9.4" | 3.5" | 5.5 | A/U | PCR Editor | More MIDI controls, two pedals, on-board memory. | |||
| Edirol | PCR-A30 | PCR-30 with built-in 24/96 audio interface | 32 | 8 | 8 | 9 | ? | 1/1 | $400 | $350 | 25.6" | 9.4" | 3.5" | 5.8 | A/U | PCR Editor | More MIDI controls, two pedals, on-board memory. | |||
| Edirol | PCR-1 | USB MIDI keyb w/ built-in 24/96 audio interface | 25 | 8 | 0 | 6 | $370 | $320 | 1.5" | 2.7 | A/U | PCR Editor | Audio interface, more MIDI controls, 2 wheels, 2 pedals, on-board memory. | |||||||
| Edirol | PCR-50 | 49-key USB MIDI keyboard | 49 | 8 | 8 | 9 | ? | 1/1 | $300 | $250 | 32.8" | 9.4" | 3.5" | 7.4 | A/U | PCR Editor | More MIDI controls, two pedals, on-board memory. | |||
| Edirol | PCR-80 | 61-key USB MIDI keyboard | 61 | 8 | 8 | 9 | ? | 1/1 | $400 | $330 | A/U | PCR Editor | More MIDI controls, two pedals, on-board memory. | |||||||
| Edirol | PC-70 | 49-key MIDI keyboard | 49 | 0 | 1 | 0 | 0/1 | 33.3" | 8.4" | 2.9" | 6 | AC | No USB, no extra MIDI controls, one footswitch (included). | |||||||
| Roland | A37 | 76-key MIDI keyboard | 76 | 0 | 1 | 0 | $500 | $360 | 47.1" | 14.6" | 4.5" | AC | Aftertouch. Two pedals. No USB or extra MIDI controls. | |||||||
| Korg | microKONTROL | 37-key USB MIDI keyboard | 37 | 8 | 8 | 16 | $350 | $300 | A/U/B | Extra MIDI controls, small size keys, 16 trigger pads. | ||||||||||
| StudioLogic | TMK-88 | 88-key MIDI keyboard | 88 | 0 | 0 | 2 | $400 | $300 | AC | No USB, no MIDI controls, full size keys, 1 wheel, 1 pedal. | ||||||||||
| Roland | AX-7 | 45-key strap-on MIDI keyboard | 45 | 0 | 0 | 2 | $500 | $400 | A/B | No USB. MIDI controls. | ||||||||||
| Novation | Remote 25 | 25-key USB MIDI keyboard | 25 | 8+8 | 8 | 24 | $600 | $400 | A/U/B | Aftertouch. LOTS of MIDI & dedicated transport controls. | ||||||||||
| Yamaha | P60 | 88-key digital piano | 88 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | $900 | $750 | AC | Comments, reviews. | |||||||||
| Yamaha | P80 | 88-key digital piano | 88 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | 53" | 11.3" | 5" | 37 | AC | Comments, reviews. | |||||||
| Yamaha | P90 | 88-key digital piano | 88 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | $1300 | $1000 | 53" | 11.3" | 5" | 37 | AC | Comments, reviews. | |||||
| Yamaha | P120S | 88-key digital piano | 88 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | $1500 | $1100 | 53.4" | 13.2" | 5.4" | 41 | AC | Comments, (reviews). Two pedals! | |||||
| Yamaha | P200 | 88-key digital piano | 88 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 1/1/1 | 54.8" | 18.2" | 6.6" | 66 | AC | Comments, (reviews). | |||||||
| Yamaha | P250 | 88-key digital piano | 88 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 1/1/1 | $2500 | $2000 | AC | Comments, reviews. | |||||||||
| Yamaha | PSR-292 | 61-key consumer/home synth | 61 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | $350 | $200 | 37.5" | 15.2" | 6.2" | 15 | A/B | (yes) | Comments | ||||
| Yamaha | DGX-202 | 76-key consumer/home synth | 76 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | $500 | $300 | 47.1" | 16.5" | 6.2" | 19 | A/B | (yes) | Comments | ||||
| Korg | SP-200 | 88-key digital piano | 88 | 0 | 0 | 0 | $1100 | $900 | 42 | AC | Comments, reviews. | |||||||||
| Kawai | MP9000 | 88-key digital piano | 88 | 4 | 0 | 0 | $ | $ | AC | Comments, reviews. | ||||||||||
| Kawai | MP9500 | 88-key digital piano | 88 | 4 | 0 | 0 | $2500 | $2000 | AC | Comments, reviews. | ||||||||||
Models to add: DGX300, DGX500, Roland RD-150 (Lily's keyboardist played one at Crystal?), RD-170, and and RD-700, Yamaha PSR-170, EZ-150, PSR-275, Kawai MP9000 & MP9500 (lighter action than Yamaha P-series), Roland FP3, Kawai ES-1, Technics P-50, Kurzweil PC-88 is well-regarded as MIDI controller in addition to digital piano. Kawai L1 and ES5 digital pianos. Good prices at www.music123.com.
P80 competition: "I played a number of keyboards while looking to buy; the ones I most seriously played and pondered over- the Roland RD150 and FP3, the Korg SP200, and the Kurzweil PC2. I liked all these keyboards, but none of them gave me the impression of playing a real piano like the P80 did. Everyone's ear and feel are different, but for me, the P80 stood out above everything near its price range." (from user review at www.harmony-central.com).
The M-Audio Ozone is a cool idea: a $250 USB audio/MIDI interface built into a 25-key MIDI keyboard. It has a number of controls atop the keyboard, and the audio interface can do 24/96 and has an XLR mic input with switchable phantom power and a 1/4" instrument input in addition to line inputs. The integration is a cool feature, but it comes at a price. For $250, one could buy a MobilePre and the Keystation 49e, which offers almost twice as many touch-sensitive music keys (but has only two pitch-bend type dials on its control panel rather than the fairly generous assortment of controls on the Ozone). The Ozone would be more attractive to me if it had a 49-key or 61-key keyboard rather than 25 keys, but I think it was designed to be a small easily portable all-in-one music device that you throw in a bag with your PowerBook and take to your techno gig. It's also small enough to mount in a 19" rack.
I should look into the keyboards listed on the GarageBand HCL. The Evolution MK-461C is $330 and has lots of controls to go along with its many keys; the Evolution line seems more deluxe than the generic M-Audio line. The 49-key Evolution is $260. M-Audio has the Keystation 49e that pretty much just has pitch and mod dials in addition to its keys at $100, the Radium49 with more MIDI controls at $200 ($160 at Sam Ash), and the Radium61 with more keys and the same control knobs/sliders/dials at $260 ($200 at Sam Ash). I guess you get what you pay for.
There is an attribute of newer USB MIDI controller/adapters called "MIDI Class" compliance. I would guess that it's an attribute of the USB implementation, just as most newer USB storage devices are "USB Mass Storage Class" compliant -- USB devices that implement certain functionality in certain common ways. Class-compliant MIDI controllers don't need drivers to work with MacOS X or Windows XP. I think that's a great idea! Who wants to chase down driver updates, praying they are available, every time your OS has an upgrade? I think I'd like a Class-compliant keyboard. The Keystation 49e is Class-compliant. All the Evolution keyboards are Class-compliant. Many of the Edirol boards claim they are "plug and play with Mac OS X"; shall I take that to mean they are Class-compliant?
macjams.com and sonicstate.com both like the Edirol PCR-30 MIDI keyboard controller. It's available for $170 from Zzounds.com with free shipping. I think it's $170 as well from Musician's Friend, which means if Guitar Center stocks it that's probably what they charge too.
Edirol is claimed to have good MacOS X support in general by macjams.com, which imputes the same Mac-orientation to M-Audio.
The PCR-30 has only one modulation wheel, which you can switch between pitch and mod functions.
The PCR-30 has a PCR Editor patch editing application for assigning functions to the assignable knobs, buttons, and sliders. You can use this to create "control maps" for various audio apps. The PCR-30 has 16 memory locations for holding these control maps, and it ships with control maps for various popular apps. GarageBand is not yet among them, but probably will be. It's easy to make your own control maps with the PC Editor. Unlike what I read somewhere, the PCR Editor is available for OS X in addition to Windows; sonicstate.com has a screen shot. If it's not in the box, download it from Edirol.
The PCR-50 is a 49-key version of the PCR-30, and the PCR-80 is a 61-key version. Supposedly, the brains are the same for all of them. Both larger models also have only the single modulation controller on the left.
The sonicstate reviewer tried to use the provided control map to make his PCR-30 a hardware controller for Logic 6.1. He says this was glitchy on his PowerBook G4, with many lost connections. He liked the MIDI input jack for attaching drum pads, and says the 32-key design is more musically useful for playing parts than the 25-key models are.
My keyboards.html file too often doesn't list how many MIDI inputs and outputs the keyboards have. The PCR series has one MIDI input and one MIDI output. If push came to shove, I could use the MIDI output to control the sounds from my other little MIDI keyboard if I just wanted to plink without booting the Mac or loading GarageBand. The sounds from that would not compare with the sounds from a current Yamaha synth.
Do I want just a MIDI controller, or should I get a synth that can be used without firing up my computer and a software synth?
How much am I willing to pay, and for which features? I still think I want 49 keys or more.
But $330 for the PCR-80 is a lot more than $100 for the Keystation 49e. It's even more than the low-end Yamaha synth models, which look to be $200 and $300.
On the other hand, why not spend a little more and get something cool? That's how I ended up with my Mac, and I'm very happy with that.
The Evolution keyboards are the main competition to the Edirol ones because they are similarly full-featured. M-Audio seems to sell the Evolution boards, and they are very Mac-oriented, so one would assume Mac drivers will be available. But M-Audio doesn't market the Evolution boards like they do their own brand; it's like they bought Evolution and are phasing them out. Maybe that doesn't matter for Mac driver compatibility, since the Evolution boards are MIDI Class compliant.
In that respect (MIDI Class compliance), the Edirols and Evolutions are better bets than the M-Audio keyboards except the Keystation 49e. If M-Audio loses interest in the Mac or goes under, presumably Class-compliant keyboards will continue to be supported by Apple's built-in MIDI drivers. Not that M-Audio is likely to give up on Macs with GarageBand fever in full swing; M-Audio can't make enough Keystation 49e keyboards to fill demand.
All this is based on the assumption that the Edirol keyboards are MIDI Class-compliant. This assumption is based on verbiage on their Web site that they are plug-and-play compatible with MacOS X. I should verify that. The Edirol keyboards (except the PCR-30) are not on the GarageBand HCL, while the M-Audio and Evolution boards are.
A 49-key keyboard would probably fit on my 36"-wide Mac rack. A 61-key keyboard would probably not fit. But then I could always put my Mac on a 48" rack instead. The larger 88-key digital pianos are at least 55" wide, and won't fit on any of the racks we have around the house. Something like that would need its own stand.
Exactly how big is the Edirol PCR-80? That information doesn't seem to be listed on the Web.
Do the M-Audio and Evolution keyboards really have separate pitch and modulation wheels? I'm finding that more and more boards I'd thought have both, have only one wheel that switches between the functions.
Last weekend was the Portland Lindy Exchange, and I spent an afternoon at Portland Music Company looking at keyboards, among other things. It was interesting and inspiring.
I want a MIDI keyboard to control the soft-synths in GarageBand. I thought it might be nice to have a keyboard with its own sounds for playing apart from the computer, so I went to Portland Music to play some synths and digital pianos. I pretty much fell in love with the feel and sound of the Yamaha P60 and P120 digital pianos. They are $750-$1100 rather than $100-$330, but I'm almost thinking I might buy one of those two or maybe a P90. I have some more study and hands-on comparison to do. I should take headphones next time, maybe better headphones than I own. People mention Grado SR-60s ($70) and Sennheiser HD-580s ($200).
All of these have 88 weighted keys, MIDI I/O but minimal other MIDI equipment, and are powered by AC adapters. None of them are MIDI Class compliant (I suspect the MIDI Class is a subspecification of USB devices, which none of these pianos are). None are listed on the GarageBand Hardware Compatibility List, which also lists only USB MIDI devices -- attached to a compatible USB MIDI converter, presumably any of these can play GarageBand soft-synths.
The below table isn't accurate; it's just a framework for inserting the accurate information. If a cell is red, it means I'm working on making that row accurate and I'm not sure about that cell's information.
| Make | Model | Pitch Wheel? |
Mod Wheel? |
MIDI knobs |
MIDI sliders |
MIDI buttons |
MIDI I/O |
List | Cost | Width | Depth | Height | Weight | Voices | P1 | P2 | P3 | P4 | EP1 | EP2 | CO1 | CO2 | JO1 | JO2 | H1 | H2 | B1 | B2 | Clav | Str | Cho | Vib | Gtr | Poly | Seq | Met | Amp | Release | Comments |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Yamaha | P60 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | $900 | $750 | 10 | 32 | 0 | 8 | 2003 | Comments, reviews. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Yamaha | P80 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | 53" | 11.3" | 5" | 37 | 12 | 64 | 1 | 0 | 1999 | Comments, reviews. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Yamaha | P90 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | $1300 | $1000 | 53" | 11.3" | 5" | 37 | 14 | 64 | 1 | 0 | 2003 | Comments, reviews. | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Yamaha | P120S | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1/1 | $1500 | $1100 | 53.4" | 13.2" | 5.4" | 41 | 10 | 64 | 3 | 12? | 2001 | Comments, reviews | ||||||||||||||||||||||
| Yamaha | P200 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 1/1/1 | 54.8" | 18.2" | 6.6" | 66 | 10 | 64 | 30 | 1998 | Comments, reviews. | |||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Yamaha | P250 | 0 | 1 | 2 | 1/1/1 | $2500 | $2000 | 10 | 128 | 30? | Comments, reviews. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Korg | SP-200 | 0 | 0 | 0 | $1100 | $900 | Comments, reviews. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Kawai | MP9000 | 4 | 0 | 0 | $ | $ | 73 | 0 | Comments, reviews. | ||||||||||||||||||||||||||||||
| Kawai | MP9500 | 4 | 0 | 0 | $2500 | $2000 | 70+ | 0 | Comments, reviews. |
Yamaha P60: Graded hammer-weighted keys, nice feel and creditable piano sound. No aftertouch. No assignable MIDI controls. Stereo speakers. 10 voices, simple controls. Piano1, piano2, electric piano1, electric piano2, harpsichord1, harpsichord2, vibes, church organ1, church organ2, strings. Reverb. Compact relative to other big digital pianos. No metronome or sequencer. 32-note polyphony. MIDI In and Out but no Through or "To Host" or USB. 8W x 2 amp/speakers and simple headphone/output jack; no line outputs. Released 2003. Reviews, lame MF "review". Playing this unit at Portland Music Company was what got me interested in buying a digital piano along with or instead of the MIDI controller I was originally looking for. The sound and feel are very appealing. There is a P60S model in silver in addition to the base model in black.
Yamaha's Web site blurb on the P60 doesn't mention "Dynamic Stereo Samples". The P60 might not have different samples for pianissimo & forte as the P90, P120, and P250 do.
The P60's case seems to be mostly plastic, with a bottom surface that looks like particle board. It's physically larger than the P90, though the weight seems close to the same.
Yamaha P80: Graded hammer-action weighted keys, nice feel and popular piano sound. No aftertouch. No assignable MIDI controls. 12 voices, simple controls. 4 piano sounds (grand, classic, jazz, rock), 2 electric pianos, harpsichord, strings, 3 organs (church, pipe, jazz), and bass. Metronome. 2-track song recorder (sequencer). Reverb, chorus, etc. 64-note polyphony. MIDI "To Host", 2 headphones, stereo Aux outs, Sustain & Aux pedal jacks. No speakers. Well-regarded, but apparently discontinued; I can't find one for sale and have never actually seen, heard, or played one of these. Released 1999. (reviews)
Yamaha P90: Graded hammer-action weighted keys, nice feel and very bright piano sound. No aftertouch. No assignable MIDI controls. 14? voices, simple controls. 2 grands, 2 electrics, jazz organ, pipe organ, choir, Clavichord, harpsichord, 2 basses, vibes, strings. Metronome. 2-track, 1-song recorder (sequencer). Reverb, chorus, etc. 64-note polyphony. Twice the ROM of the P80. MIDI In, MIDI Out, and MIDI "To Host" serial ports. 2 headphones, stereo Aux outs, Sustain & Aux pedal jacks. No speakers. Released May 2003. Reviews claim same action and samples as the P120 and P250. "A P120 in black without the speakers, and four pounds lighter." The P90 is physically the smallest digital piano I've seen. It's case is all-metal. Seems kind of minimalist, designed for the gigging musician who needs to haul it around. I find it attractive as a piece of gear.
Yamaha P120: Graded hammer-action weighted keys, nice feel and creditable piano sound. No aftertouch. No assignable MIDI controls. 14 voices, simple controls. 2 pianos, 2 electric pianos, 2 harpsichords, church organ, jazz organ, strings, choir, nylon guitar, 2 basses, vibes, Clavichord. Metronome. 2-track, 3-song recorder (sequencer). Reverb, chorus, etc. 64-note polyphony. MIDI In , MIDI Out, and MIDI "To Host" serial ports. 2 headphones, stereo Aux outs, Sustain & Aux pedal jacks. Stereo speakers. The P120S has a silver-colored base; the P120 has a black-colored base. Some reviewers say the grand piano on the P120 is bright and harsh compared to the P80; not as nice for classical. Others disagree. Most agree that the non-piano sounds on the P120 beat those of the P80, but these pianos are really for the piano sounds. Released 2001. (lame MF "review") / (harmony-central reviews)
Rok Zibrat, from Ljubljana in Slovenia, tells me I've also been comparing Yamaha P-120 to their less expensive models. One notable difference (to any piano player) that most of the reviewers seem to overlook is that P-120 has two-pedal capability. This means that you can buy an additional pedal, plug it in the AUX PEDAL port and use it one of the configurable ways. A piano player would probably use it as a damper pedal, but there are also other uses (e.g. expression). Rok learned this from, and pointed me to, Yamaha's online manuals page. Thanks, Rok!
Yamaha P200: "It has many of the outstanding piano features found in the P120/P120S plus a full array of MIDI control functions." The "full array" looks like pitch and mod wheels and a couple of buttons. 12 voices. 30Wx2. Released 1998; probably discontinued now, as I can't find any for sale. Interesting that Yamaha's Web verbiage almost implies this model followed the P120. Some harmony-central users are selling these to buy P90/120/250 series boards.
Yamaha P250: Updated P200: samples from P90/P120, but more expensive VLSI engine for more accurate rendering. 128-note polyphony (most other P-series are 64-note). Metronome. 16-track song recorder (sequencer). Reverb, chorus, etc. MIDI In, MIDI Out, and MIDI To Host serial ports; USB MIDI interface for direct connection to computer (the Web site doesn't indicate whether it's USB MIDI Class compliant). These things run $1900-2200, so I haven't really been considering one.
Kawai MP9000: Pitch and Mod wheels, 4 assignable MIDI knobs. Weighted keys. Pretty well-reviewed. Lighter touch than Yamaha's, which some people like better. The MP9000 has been discontinued and replaced by the MP9500; I haven't seen any of these for sale new. It seems to have been released circa 1998.
Kawai MP9500: Pitch and Mod wheels, 4 assignable MIDI knobs. Weighted keys. Pretty well-reviewed. Lighter touch than Yamaha's. A few people said they thought this has the best action available, but they bought P250s because they sounded better.
Thanks to Greg Riddick from Virginia, who e-mailed me:
Liked your Midi keyboard page...just one correction. Both the Kawai MP9000/9500 have assignable midi controls ( 4 knobs).
I've got the mp9000--nice instrument, but Grand piano is the only usable piano sound IMO. Mellow piano is nice but doesn't sing in the
upper octaves. Good electric piano Rhodes and Wurlitzer sounds. Nice Hammond sound that is switchable from slow to fast Leslie speaker
through the pedal--cool, you can actually hear the Leslie speeding up and slowing down.
The MP9000 has a non-graded action, so is lighter in the lower octaves. Upper octaves close to concert grand in action --
will give you fingers a workout, though I'm getting used to it!
BTW, the MP9500 has been discontinued in the US so will be difficult to find. You might find one in a Sam Ash.
Cheers, Greg
Korg SP-200: No assignable MIDI controls. Weighted keys. "Touch curves". 4 piano & 1 electric piano voices. Metronome.
Roland FP-2: A small, pretty silvery aluminum unit, the size of a stage piano but styled more for the home environment. I've only seen this in a Roland catalog and on the Web, not in real life yet. It's looking like the FP-2 is being released to replace the FP-3. It has an 88-key progressive hammer-action keyboard, 64-voice polyphony, and two built-in speakers. It has a USB MIDI port, it's GM-2 compliant, and it has a Session Partner with 80 rhythms. It would be interesting to hear one. They are shipping now, for $1300 without a stand or as the FP-2C for $1500 with stand, foot pedal, etc.
Roland FP-3: A small, pretty champagne aluminum unit, the size of a stage piano but styled more for the home environment. I've played one on four different occasions, split across two examples, and every time I thought the sound was kind of artifical and digital. I think only on the last playing did I really figure out how to change the sounds, but I still think I prefer the Yamaha P60. The FP-3 has 88 keys, 64-note polyphony, and 40 different tones. The FP3 is about $1300. All the ones I've seen have had an attached stand that I really like; it looks sturdy yet unobtrusive and it stays out of the way of your knees, unlike those X-stands people gig with. I noticed that Musician's Friend sells the FPS-10A stand separately, and it's $200 -- ouch! I wonder if that stand would also work with the RD series? I also noticed that Musician's Friend isn't stocking the FP-3 any more, so presumably the FP-2 has replaced it in Roland's line.
Roland FP-5: I played one of these through my Grado SR60 headphones, and I thought it sounded a lot better than the FP-3. It has an 88-key progressive hammer-action keyboard, 64-voice polyphony, 316 tones, and two built-in speakers. There are more panel controls than the FP-2 or FP-3 have. There are three pedal jacks, and the FP-5 includes a DP-8 damper pedal with half-pedal capability. There are "setup memories" for recalling specific configurations. It had a USB MIDI port, which I think the FP-3 lacks, and has a fun Session Partner function with 80 rhythm tracks you can play along with. That's kind of toy-like, but fun, and the sound is better than on the toy keyboards. There is a "three-track recorder" sequencing function. At $1600 (Gracewinds), it's close in cost to an RD-700. At Musician's Friend, the FP-5 without a stand is $1400, the FP-5C with a stand is $1600, and the FPS-11A stand itself is $200.
Roland RD-150: A workhorse Roland stage piano from a few years ago; I've seen a few of these on stages with swing bands. It was discontinued and replaced by the RD-170; I haven't seen any RD-150s for sale new.
Roland RD-170: Roland's lower-end stage piano in the current line-up. I've seen a couple of these on stages, and maybe one on display at Portland Music. 88 progressive hammer-action keys, 64-voice polyphony, 64 tones, MIDI controller mode, half-pedal mode with optional DP-8 pedal, split and layer functions, 2-track recorder. At around $1300, it's slightly more expensive than most of the Yamahas but I'm interested in hearing its "dark Roland piano sound", since I find the Yamahas a little too bright. I'd like to compare one side-by-side with a Yamaha and with the RD-700.
Roland RD-700: Roland's higher-end stage piano. Lots more voices than the Yamahas have, and a wider variety of piano tones from dark to bright. Yamaha's primary grand voice would be 50-70% into the brightness range of the Roland. I've only played an RD-700 for a couple of hours, but I think I like the tonal range better than the Yamahas, although I think the Yamaha's playing action is nicer. The Roland keys hit the bottom of their travel with solidity, so playing is a little like drumming your fingers on a table (this was true of one of the two RD-700s I've played with).
Lots more buttons for selecting and editing sounds than the Yamahas have. The RD-700 has 128-voice polyphony and 16-parts multi-timbrality with 64MB wave ROMs. 50 on-board rhythms for practice. The RD-700 has two slots for Roland's SRX expansion cards, each of which adds 64MB more samples to the 64MB built-in. The SRX-02 Concert Piano sample board is quite well-reviewed; I've seen it for $220-350 new or $200 on eBay. At $1800, the RD-700 is way more money than I ever planned on spending, but the tone is pretty good and I'm considering it. I think it was released in 2001.
I still have some listening to do to the RD-700. It sounded good on a couple of occasions through my headphones, but another day I forgot the 'phones, and thought the RD-700 sounded ridiculously bassy through its line-outs to a keyboard amp.
Reading about the Yamaha P-series pianos on harmony-central.com, most users like them.
In general, the reviews of the P60 lack detail and comparisons with other models, though they are almost all positive. The reviews of the P90 and P120 are much more detailed and provide a lot of comparisons to other models, particularly the P80. These reviews are far less uniformly enthusiastic, but probably better-informed, and are mostly positive. There is a vocal contingent who don't care about any sound other than Grand Piano 1, and who feel the P80's GP1 is rounder and mellower while the P120's is brighter and harsher; these folks either keep their P80s or sell their P120s to buy P80s because they prefer the P80 for classical playing. That's a little distressing to me, since round and mellow and classical sounds like something I'd like better than bright and jazz-rockish. Someone says this is because Yamaha sampled Yamaha pianos, which are brighter; that person wished they'd included one sample of a Steinway for classical use.
How you listen to the pianos vastly affects how they sound. The P80 lacks speakers, so people usually listen to it through the studio monitors in the showroom or through their home stereo. The P120 has built-in speakers, so people usually listen to it through those. They don't have the bass response that better speakers would. A few careful reviewers took headphones to do their comparisons; that seems like a good idea to me, since I will use headphones a lot as I stay up way too late playing.
The P90 and P120 probably have enough extra features and cool sounds to justify the price premium over the P60. They probably also have better samples and/or rendering engines. I should carefully listen to them all, though. I'm concerned not only with how they sound through their built-in speakers, if any, but as well with how they sound through headphones and how they'll sound running direct into my 828mkII or some other recording device.
If the P90 and P120 really are essentially the same board in differing packages, how to decide? Slightly smaller black or silver package without speakers, or slightly heavier wood/black or wood/silver package with speakers? The $100 difference is pretty negligible. Someone said the P90's case is metal, while the P120's is faux-wood with cardboard on the bottom. I suspect but should confirm that both support soft-pedaling and ship with the required pedal. The P120's sequencer supports three songs, the P90's only one.
Some users refer to the Korg CX-3 as the best synthesized jazz organ available.
Someone says compare the P120, the Roland FP-3, and the Kawai ES-1.
Yamaha PSR292: No assignable MIDI controls. GM compatible. "Touch response". 605 voices, 135 accompaniment styles, 100 songs. 6-track sequencer? Training modes. DSP reverb, chorus, & echo? Sustain pedal & phones/output jacks. 9W Stereo speakers. Not sure how this differs from DGX-202 besides number of piano keys and the missing pitch-bend wheel. Also don't know how it differs from the very similar PSR-275.
Yamaha DGX202: No assignable MIDI controls. GM compatible. "Touch response". 605 voices, 135 accompaniment styles, 100 songs. 6-track sequencer. Training modes. DSP reverb, chorus, & echo. Sustain pedal & phones/output jacks. 12W Stereo speakers.
I visited Guitar Center in Eugene to see what kinds of keyboards they carry. I was pleased to see the Yamaha P60S, P90, and P120 in stock. This will help me compare them. There was a selection of pro and consumer synthesizers and a few MIDI control boards, too.
I played their P60S. Through its internal speakers, it sounds pretty good. I found the keyboard action considerably heavier, and sort of muffled-feeling compared to their P90. A Guitar Center salesman told me the P60 has a "plain weighted" keyboard while P90 has a "graded hammer-action weighted" keyboard, but Yamaha's Web site says they all have the same graded hammer-action weighted keyboard. Perhaps there is quite a range in the way these things feel?
Yamaha's Web site blurb on the P60 doesn't mention "Dynamic Stereo Samples". The P60 might not have different samples for pianissimo & forte as the P90, P120, and P250 do. Interestingly, I might prefer it anyway because it sounds rounder and not so bright as the P90 does.
The action of the P90 felt much lighter, easier, and maybe faster. I wondered if this could be due to the angle at which the keyboard rested in the big multi-keyboard rack that held it. But the sound was, as some harmony-central posters have noted, very bright. I'm not sure I'd say "harsh", as some have, but I thought the P60 sounded rounder and more elegant for classical playing. The P90 was plugged into a pair of Yamaha studio monitors costing $250 each, while the P60 spoke through its built-in speakers. Next time I should take a couple pairs of headphones.
The P250 has a 16-track sequencer, not just 2-track like others.
P60 has MIDI In and MIDI Out.
P90 & P120 have MIDI In, MIDI Out, and To Host serial MIDI ports.
P250 has MIDI In, MIDI Out, To Host serial, and USB MIDI interfaces. No indication whether the P250 is MIDI Class compliant.
P60: No Dynamic Stereo Samples, 10 voices, no sequencer, no metronome, no soft pedaling capability, no To Host port. But, I actually think I like the piano voice better than the P90's, which as harmony-central posters have said, is rather too bright. 8W speakers.
P90: Dynamic Stereo Samples, 14 voices, 1-song sequencer, metronome, soft pedaling capability, To Host port. No speakers.
P120: Dynamic Stereo Samples, 14 voices, 3-song sequencer, metronome, soft pedaling capability, To Host port, 12.5W speakers.
P250: Dynamic Stereo Samples, 14 voices, deluxe rendering engine, 16-song sequencer, metronome, soft pedaling capability, To Host and USB ports, 30W speakers.
I bought a KeyStation 49e a few weeks ago. It's not an aesthetic treat to play like a digital piano is, but it's plug and play with my Mac, and it fits on the computer rack. Now I am playing with GarageBand while I take my time dithering over a more realistic digital piano. I suspect I'll end up leaving the KeyStation 49e connected to the Mac, because the larger keyboard would be hard to setup close to my computer rack.
At Piano Liquidators in Eugene, I compared some digital pianos against acoustic ones. There is no comparison. Acoustic pianos sound and feel much better. Even the not-so-good acoustic pianos have charms the digitals can't approach. It made me question the digital piano idea. But there is no way I can own an acoustic in our apartment, and I'd rather play a digital piano than nothing.
I played the Roland RD-700. I think some of its voices are closer to what I'm looking for in a digital piano -- not so bright as the Yamaha P-series. It has bright samples, but also mellower ones. It's not all rosy; somehow the samples don't sound as hi-fi, as if Yamaha uses 64MB of ROM to store 14-20 samples, while Roland uses 64MB ROM to store 30-50. But the tonal balance of the instrument is pretty important, and Roland's is less unbalanced that way. It would be interesting to hear Roland's SRX-02 module, a 64MB expansion module for their synths that fits the RD-700: 64MB of ROM devoted solely to piano sounds.
The RD-700 plays a little funny; I seem to prefer the Yamaha's keyboard feel. The Roland's keys feel like they are bottoming out against wood, while the Yamaha's feel like there is more bounce (do they hit felt at the bottom?). I'm still thinking about whether sound or feel is more important to me.
Gracewinds Music in Corvallis has the P60, P90, and RD-700 in stock. I only had 5 minutes to play with them last time I went through Corvallis. It would be good to take my headphones and go back. I'd also like to compare the RD-700 against the RD-170, which I've never played.
I'm not sure I can justify spending $1800 on a digital piano. Could the P60 be 70% as good, for 42% of the price?
I spent three and a half hours playing with digital pianos at Gracewinds in Corvallis. It was very interesting. I finally brought my own headphones for listening, and that helped. I listened to four pianos, mostly: the Roland RD-700, the Roland FP-5, the Yamaha P60, and the Yamaha P90. Gracewinds has a P120 also, but I didn't play it.
I was surprised by the FP-5. I thought the FP-3 I played at Portland Music and the one at Piano Liquidators in Eugene sounded pretty digital and fake; the FP-5 sounded pretty good. The Session Partner feature is pretty fun, too. In tone, I'd rank this second behind the RD-700 of these four pianos. Gracewinds is asking $1600 for their FP-5.
The RD-700 is as I thought: not as nice as a real acoustic piano, but a variety of nice sounds. It somehow sounds more like a wooden instrument than any of the others. This model doesn't feel as much like your fingers are running into solid wood at the bottom of the key travel as the one at Piano Liquidators. Gracewinds is asking $1800 for their RD-700. The Roland doesn't have any tones that are exactly like the Yamaha sounds, which would have eased my choice. It has two variants on "Rock piano", which are even more exageratedly extreme than the P90. It reminded me of a harpsichord tone.
The P90 really does sound too bright, too much a caricature, in this company. It's a nice unit, and the sample sounds hi-fi, they just sampled a too-bright piano (I guess). For rock and some other kinds of music, that tone might be great for cutting through the mix, but it's not for me.
The P60 sounds better to me than the P90 does. The sample isn't as hi-fi, but the instrument has a better tonal balance. It doesn't sound nearly as good as the RD-700, I thought, but it is probably usable. My last question from yesterday will be a crucial one in my quest: is the P60 70% as good as the RD-700, for 42% of the price? Is it only 50% as good? Does the difference in sound justify the $1000 difference in price?
To sum up, the RD-700 is still at the top of my list, while the P90 has almost slid off it. The FP-5 is surprisingly nice; right now I give the RD-700 the edge, but I would like to play them both more before deciding. I could end up deciding that the Rolands are nice, but the Yamaha P60 is good enough for the money. I still haven't played a Roland RD-170 or Kawai MP9500, and I saw in a Roland catalog that they have released an FP-2 at $1300 street. Does that replace the FP-3? Is the sample better? The FP-2 has a USB MIDI port.
I went to Gracewinds with plastic in my pocket, hoping one of the digital pianos would sell itself to me. I forgot my headphones, so I had to listen to the pianos either through their own built-in speakers or through one of two Roland keyboard amps Gracewinds has. This also meant I couldn't really play, self-conscious about my complete beginnerhood.
I found the Yamaha P60 the same as always: a bright piano sound, not terribly hi-fi, not many alternative sounds, but probably usable.
I was shocked at how the RD-700 and the P90 sounded through that Roland amp. The RD-700, in particular, sounded much different than I remember. It was rounded and tubular-sounding, very bassy and lacking mid and high frequencies. The P90 sounded somewhat squashed, but it still had some high-end left. I was looking for tone controls on the keyboards and on the amps that I could tweak back to flat, since the tone sounded so modified, but didn't find the controls. Maybe you can tweak the tones deep in the setup menus on each piano, or on the amp? It would be good to find out how to return the instruments to factory defaults if I'm going to make meaningful comparisons in the store.
Either the tone controls of the Roland had been tweaked this last time, or the Roland sounds vastly different through its line-outs than through its headphone jacks. That could be a huge problem. I'll do most of my playing through the headphone jacks, but I'd certainly want to be able to use the line-outs for recording and for gigging if I ever get that far. I don't think I would use the sound I was hearing through that Roland amp.
On Harmony Central, the Roland reviews are split between those who love the "dark Roland sound" and those who prefer a bright Yamaha sound. I had thought those really were two different groups of users, with rock/blues pianists who need to "cut through the mix" prefering the Yamahas and acoustic/classical players preferring the richer Roland sound. Maybe the diversity of opinion depends in part on some people listening through headphones and others through the line-outs to an amp or stereo system.
I thought briefly about just buying a P60, but I want to do some more thorough testing first. I'd like to get started with lessons and playing the piano, but I'm not in a huge hurry to buy one. Since Linda has left, I want to completely rearrange the apartment, and go through the storage unit getting rid of stuff. That will give me more room at the apartment to set up my new digital piano, but the work involved is less likely to get done if I have a piano to play instead. I think I'll give myself July to get things in order, then think about buying the piano. That will give me more time for testing, too.
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